An albatros level crock of junk - only loony's need apply.

sev

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Back in 2008 JHP built some bikes for Buildbase Ducati, a full fat WSB and a superstock bike. Rutter rode the grown up one, and Laverty rode the superstock.

The livery was shit, the riders were not.

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Roll the clock on 14 years and the bike ends up in many different hands.

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Roll the clock on another couple of months, and with some bits judiciously parted out it looks like this

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The front end had already gone (to me) for the 999, and in return it's wearing the front end from the 999.

On the rear It had also lost it's ten spoke wheel and gained a truly vile dymag three spoke. The previous owner sold the wheel off on it's own rather than as a matching pair.

The front wheel, as was the rear, is a magnesium Marchesini M10R, both were 916 fitment.

I will tell you now that these pictures do the thing much justice, as in the life the thing's a complete and utter snotter.

It's the perfect example of something which has probably passed through hands always trading on the past glory of it's origins and past. The only thing left of this original bike was a frame and the engine. The rest... well...

My gut feeling told me that most of this thing was going in the bin, and to be fair once I started dissecting it, I wasn't wrong.



1098 Autopsy

Component :
FRAME

The frame is unstamped and has no VIN, not unless it's hidden under all that crappy powdercoat. Either way, no good for putting back on the road.

It's not an R frame, rather a bog stock S frame. there is no provision for roadgoing gubbins like ignition barrels or lockstops.

Handlebars were ancient fast by ferraci clip ons - which had some horrible old probably japanese bars hammered into them, so much so that they're for the skip. I tried putting a new set of SES tubes in there and they just won't go in this side of a 22mm reamer working its magic. One of the many previous cherubs past didn't work this out and so decided to get medieval on them and knacker them even more. A bit pants really.

Verdict: Keep to make an ornament out of, but other than that the bike needs a new frame with V5. This has been sourced and is currently away for paint.

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Component : Swingarm

The swingarm had a vile carbon kevlar cover which was painted black and mastic'd on. The black paint on the whole was rattle can black as the bolt heads were the same colour.

The bearings in the arm we'll start with a clean up and regrease to see if they play nice. There's minor corrosion on the bushes, again I'll see how they clean up.

The hub on the arm is a small axle hub, What I thought was a small hub 848 was infact actually a 916 hub - hence the surprising amount of spacer shims used to space out sprocket and stub axle sides. Impressive to say the least.

The caliper carrier was not from the xxx8, but from a 916. The difference being that the 916 caliper mounts slightly differently, it's rolled forward vs the 1098 mounting as the arm wasn't as meaty.

This caused some real issues as the leading edge bolt which holds the caliper fouled the swingarm, which meant, no caliper off, no axle off. Eventually it was a case of tapping and unscrewing a turn at a time. Not ideal, and the hub was offering a fair bit of resistance to coming free anyway.

What was really impressive was that the chap had taken the time to countersink the bolts in order to get them to clear!

The rear caliper is 916, and early 916 at that... and seized. I want to be surprised, I'm not.

There are two swingarms to pay with, and I'm not a fan of the silver arm so I think this will be going black - but done right not out of an arsehole can. There is also the big axle original 1098 hub, no axle nut or spindle nut, and shims are missing. The 916 hub runs a renthal carrier, but it won't carry over to the 1098 hub.

Verdict: Full refurb is probably the best option and reinstate the 1098 hub. Such bodgery effort cannot go without applause, as lets face it, if he'd had spent as much care on the thing as he had on his bodging, it would be a little jewel.





Component : Wheels and Tyres

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The bike is running 916-998 wheels. The rear wheel was a marchesini M10R magnesium to match the front. This got sold on , and the 3 spoke dymag was put in its place. Had the ten spoke stayed I'd have probably rolled with that and a 180 section tyre, and I'd have got an 848 caliper hanger. As it is, that wheel and the 10 spoke mag front are for the sale pile. I'll put the money back into proper 1098 rims and run on a 190/55 rear.

Tyres are Dunlop wets. Brand new and not a lot of use to me, the intent was that they'd go to fund the replacements, as it was I gave them to @RickyX for one of his cheeky smiles.

When the tires were removed we discover the front wheel, like the swingarm has just been rattlecanned black, as you can still see the original marchesini racing gold underneath. Burger flipper, that's what they are... burger flippers.

Verdict: Source 1098 wheels. Not high on the priority list at the moment.



Component : Suspension

I've already got the ohlins front forks and they're fully refurbed. The rear shock has seen better days, the spring is pretty manky and it's probably never been serviced. The shock is standard OEM ohlins in appearance but for a remote preload and the engraving JL2, so I'll get that refurbed and see if we can do anything nice with the internals, as I'd like to keep it for it's history.

The front end was held with a pair of Ducati Performance 916 magnesium yokes. 30mm offset I believe.

A steering damper will also need to be sourced.

Verdict: Refurb rear shock and source steering damper. 1098 Top yoke found for much cheapness and I've got enough 999 yokes to marry up to it. The mag yokes can go on the 916 when that finally gets built.



Component : Brakes

Brakes are 916 fitment. I have two pairs, a set of AP rotors and a pair of galfer wavey discs. They're going- I don't do wavy discs.

Of all the things on this bike that's an easy win for me it's the stoppy bits. I've got decent master cylinders and calipers and discs, front and back catered for. At the most a new rear disc and some new brake lines.

Verdict: measure up brake lines and rummage in the box of bits when the swingarm and frame come back from refinishing. - phew.



Component : Subframes

Both front and rear frames are Pierobon. There are also a set of spare frames, again both pierobon.

The front subframe has been down and is pretty bent up, with a pull it back to straight attempt at recovery. The spare rear subframe is in a sorry state, and has the lower mounting points partially cut away in a quick release stylee. Both subframes have had the tanks torn off them at some point judging by the tank stay bracket deformation.

Verdict: front roadbike subframe bought, and headlamp and taillight sourced. One pair of the pierobon subframes will be heading for the skip.



Component : Bodywork

All for the skip. The spare side panels are rashed. The spare bellypan is the original CM composite carbon one and still has the buildbase livery on it, but again, heavily repaired. The remaining black bodywork is CRC fibreglass and I can see me just binning it. there are two plastic OEM 1098 tanks, one black one red that the buildbase bike probably ran with as the colour matches the bellypan, the other I would guess, if the rest of the bike is anything to go by has satisfied the man's black rattlecan fetish. The bike is running a what I hope to be Ducati performance quick release filler - but again I'm not hopeful. I'm not a fan of QR fillers on road bikes, but the other option is to go hunting for a complete lockset, which is probably what I'll end up doing.

The cosmetics aren't high on my list of to do's at the moment as you can imagine.

Verdict: front roadbike subframe bought, and headlamp and taillight sourced.



Component : Cooling

51294926758_20e8efa5ff.jpg
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Radiator is damaged and has had a bodge repair. I'll get it pressure tested to see if it's any good but for the money there's plenty of decent ones for sale and chinese alan does a new one for sub 100, and all I'll have to do is get a left hand fan for it.

Oil cooler is a 999 item. Both have been down the road. I've got a 1098 cooler which I bought for the SS.. looks like it's got a new home. The correct radiator stay has been sourced. The oil lines are also bodged. Very bodged. So a set of 1098R oil lines are also on the cards by the look of it.

The water pipes are samco, but also hard pipes as well, so hopefully we'll keep those if they're not to beaten up.

Verdict: fit 1098 cooler and investigate radiator options. Close eyes and weep at the cost of 1098R oil lines.
 

sev

Well-known member
Subscriber
Component : Wiring harness

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Harness is new, and has suffered hardly any butchery, with most of the road tackle just being carefully zip tied out of the way - that makes me happy.

The bike runs a nemesis ECU, and there is a traction control module and quickshifter.

There's also a bag of connectors - nothing special or trick in there, just the old loom's connectors chopped off the harness, but always nice to have.

I need to get a lockset for the bike, and this I think makes life a lot easier for me, as I believe the clocks are probably virgin - so won't have the immobiliser coded.

I've got a backup 5AM ECU which @chrisw can flash if it turns out that this stuff is foobarred.

Verdict: Investigate regular road shift options for the quickshifter and get manuals and advice for the traction control module.



Component : Exhaust

It's an Akrapovic Evo 70mm Titanium system. YAY, and the primaries look all of the awesome.

But it's royally how can we put this... If he'd sold this to someone on the bay, they would have lost their shit pretty early on after taking delivery..

the end caps are mashed, the heatshield is torched to a crisp, and the straps are long gone. There is erm.. track patina if you will, but other wise, the repair and refurb of those cans isn't funny. Put it this way, the end caps alone are 110 quid each, and the ti sleeve and proper carbon straps don't come in cheap either. That said the rebuild kits from Akra are very comprehensive, having bought one for a GSXR750 end can in the past I was impressed, so I can't complain.

Knowing how toasty these things get I did have a passing thought about getting zircotec to breath on it - a tentative eqnquiry and it turns out the cost is cheaper than a set of ti sleeves, go figure.

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Verdict: All service items ordered. Eye watering I may add.
 
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sev

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Component : Engine

And now for the money shot.

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The engine has blue rocker covers - they have gone to be stripped and repainted as whoever thought that was a good ideal should fuck off and buy an escort xr3i.

There's lots of nice things on this engine.

The cases are Sandcast 1098RS cases

The clutch is a 4 post slipper as used on works bikes, and comes with a spare hub and spider spring.

It will need a starter motor for what I want.

The engine was sold as being an R engine. It wasn't. 166 RWHP confirms that I think.

John Burrows at JHP confirmed the following (lets hope the internals are still as listed):
They last had the bike in about 10 years ago for maintenance, the spec then was as original build spec.

The original build spec was as follows:
1098 RS World Superbike crankcases
1098 S steel crank and rods
106mm barrels and pistons (making it 1150cc)
13.25:1 compression ratio
1.15 squish
1098 RS cams
1098 cylinder heads
996 RS gearbox

Verdict: Starter motor bought, inspect clutch for condition, respray cam covers, get my prayer mat out that the box isn't trollied.



I had some engine stands made some time back as well. The height on them is 300mm off the ground and the intention was that I could build the whole bike on them and have clearance for fitting the exhausts etc, or use them as a dolly for existing bikes. The 916 and 996 engines are on the other two stands. They're stainless and can happily support the engine and the weight of the rest of the rolling chassis.

51294930173_a24cd5123e_b.jpg




It's going to be a lot of work. Currently this thing is an utter pile. Within 24hours I really wish I'd never talked myself into buying the frikkin thing if I'm honest.
 
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sev

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The previous owner was told that the engine was rebuilt before its dyno run, which was in January 2020 at Dynotech Performance. If the bike hasn't been fucked around with inside since this was shot I'm in a reasonable place as ultimately, it survived. On the Dynotech dyno it pulled 166hp. It got bits of paper with colours and lines and everyfink.

The video of said dynorun...


On the research trail I rang the little ray of sunshine that is BSD and he said that the nemesis ECU is now obsolete, and no longer in production and he doesn't really support it.

He proffered the advice that if it were him, he'd look to start the bike only on the ECU and don't worry about the TCS as they were a sealed system and if it's shit itself you'll be chasing your tail forever. - trust me I'm grateful for that nugget.

Speaking to Chris Stedman at CJS, his opinion was to junk the Nemesis, he's right in that the IAW5AM 610 ECU that came as standard is a much better ECU, and the only reason you ever went nemesis was because back then the OE ecu was sealed so you couldn't remap. That's no longer the case, our ChrisW can flash the 5AM I have with the 1098 70mm termignoni base map.

In the end it'll probably end up in clutton as I get the feeling that Chris and Rich can breath a bit more life in this puppy with some nice dyno time.

If I don't keep the nemesis stuff for posterity I'm sure it'll be worth something to someone and still fetch money for a racer as they like them due to immobiliser deletes and also because they can piss around with them - however that said the software wont run on anything newer than windows XP.

Next step is to look at bearings and get the swingarm and rocker covers ready for the refinisher and then some bearings in there.

Every time I look at the pile I just sit there thinking.. what on earth was I thinking!

I can't blame the bloke who sold it to me, he only saw the AP calipers and that's why he bought it, to take those off and move the rest on, as he thought it would be an easy win - till he found out ducati ownners are all bellends and want provenance and properness and don't buy heaps of shit...

Lets face it. Only a proper fruitloop treehouse nutter would buy such a thing, and then only one who was practiced in shooting himself in the foot and cutting his nose off to spite his face.
 
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final_edition

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I must dig out the Nemesis TC etc paperwork...

Iirc the bike, when sold on from the JHP umbrella, was comprehensively destroyed by Dallas.

@dibble can advise on the crash.
 
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final_edition

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I do have pictures from Guadix when DP had it. Although the paintwork may have been slightly different.
 
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sev

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I must dig out the Nemesis TC etc paperwork...

Iirc the bike, when sold on from the JHP umbrella, was comprehensively destroyed by Dallas.

@dibble can advise on the crash.
Thanks FE.
I know that this wasn't the full fat bsb bike, just the superstock and so I know there was more than one that got out into the wild. I'm guessing that as it was an ssk bike most of it was just a standard production machine off the sales floor in terms of equipment and specs.
 

final_edition

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As far as I know, a Microtec M197 can be adjusted for fueling for each cylinder, where the Ducati ecu cannot.
 
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final_edition

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Thanks FE.
I know that this wasn't the full fat bsb bike, just the superstock and so I know there was more than one that got out into the wild. I'm guessing that as it was an ssk bike most of it was just a standard production machine off the sales floor in terms of equipment and specs.
Although sstock, it was a thing of assembled beauty, that only a few can achieve.
 

sev

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Although sstock, it was a thing of assembled beauty, that only a few can achieve.
Thats what I imagine, very well built vs lots of whizbangs.

never fails to amaze me that so many people think track bike is an excuse to sling some old shitheap together.
 

sev

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As far as I know, a Microtec M197 can be adjusted for fueling for each cylinder, where the Ducati ecu cannot.
Was that with two wideband lambda's ?
Also would anyone have a spare set of 1098R oil cooler lines they want to part company with?
The ones that were on there have been royally bodged to make a hybrid fitment.. ingenious in its execution... and very shit.
 

CAT3

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As an option, you could buy suitable oil hose & anodised JIC fittings from Torques in Swansea & make your own oil cooler hoses up.
I did that for my 750SS & put fire sleeve on them as well.
DSCN3958.JPG

DSCN3957.JPG

Might not be the cheapest option, but they look the part, or at least I thought so !!:ROFLMAO:
 

sev

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RS and R runs a spigot with o-rings rather than the normal threaded adaptor into the crankcases.

hence my dilemma. :)
 

CAT3

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This sort of thing ?
Not sure if this is the only similar type fitting they do, but might be worth asking them, they are very helpful.
You never know, if there's a market for such parts they might even start making them, if they don't already.
 

sev

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This sort of thing ?
Not sure if this is the only similar type fitting they do, but might be worth asking them, they are very helpful.
You never know, if there's a market for such parts they might even start making them, if they don't already.
nope.
This is what the part should look like which fits into the crank cases
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Oil cooler end is standard ducati post 2003 fitting at the line.

It wouldn't have been a problem if the nobend hadn't butchered the original fitting to fit on a standard fitting and then mullered it some more to fit.
Apparently he was an ex-bsb mechanic you know... weren't the all.
 

CAT3

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Ahh, right I see what you mean now.
Having said that, to me I would think it would be very easy to turn some adaptors up with the double o-ring grooves & maybe a 6AN or 8AN JIC end on that you could then attach normal 6AN or 8AN hose fitting to.
When I say easy, an engineering shop with CNC lathe would breeze that. They would be a lot easier to make that the Suzuki type adaptors I thought you meant, from alloy or even steel or stainless steel.
Obviously the cost to make said adaptors, depending upon numbers, would be quite expensive over readily available, off-the-shelf parts, but they'd be worth the effort I think. If you had a few made you could maybe sell a few to recover some of the cost as there must be a market for them.

You know what these sorts of project are like, you might have a budget in mind, but once you start that soon goes out of the window !!(y):ROFLMAO:
 

final_edition

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I think there are Ducati coolers that have the push in fittings at the cooler end.

Maybe a Multi.....really long hoses.

I bought a pair and had Earl's re swage them onto their own oil pipe with -4 fittings on the end, for my application of R motor.
 

final_edition

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Any use?
 
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sev

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I think there are Ducati coolers that have the push in fittings at the cooler end.

Maybe a Multi.....really long hoses.

I bought a pair and had Earl's re swage them onto their own oil pipe with -4 fittings on the end, for my application of R motor.
Aye. Lines with them on are a bit thin on the ground at the moment, so I’m keeping an eye out.

twowheeledspares have a set of monster 1200 ones for 80 quid, which I’m a bit loathed to pay if I’m looking to butcher the lines just for the ends.

something’ll come up. I’m in no rush.
I’ve contacted jhp to tey and get the original spec of the bike before it left them to go into the hands of burger flippers.

Ive got a spare set of ti rods tucked away so i might look to get them fitted, which gives me a chance to see the state of the inside of the engine that this so called bsb mechanic put together. If its like the rest of his handywork it’ll be fucked in there.
 

sev

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Lines ordered. The best two wheeled spares could counter offer on his 80 quid was 75 plus delivery.
The guy in the states on the second link took a less than 50% best offer and with shipping, taxes, duty and delivery comes in way less than the 2whs. offer.
At that sort of price I'm happy to have lines chopped up.

@final_edition or @Robarano could you tell me the length of the line, or at least the braided portion from swage to swage?
I've got a set of stock 1098 lines, and my guess is that the only difference is the end section in terms of braided length.
Ta muchly.
 

final_edition

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Lines ordered. The best two wheeled spares could counter offer on his 80 quid was 75 plus delivery.
The guy in the states on the second link took a less than 50% best offer and with shipping, taxes, duty and delivery comes in way less than the 2whs. offer.
At that sort of price I'm happy to have lines chopped up.

@final_edition or @Robarano could you tell me the length of the line, or at least the braided portion from swage to swage?
I've got a set of stock 1098 lines, and my guess is that the only difference is the end section in terms of braided length.
Ta muchly.
Hiya @sev my lines are a non standard length, so cannot measure for your application.
 
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sev

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Latest discoveries:

Plug Coils:

51369354131_4c4e52699d_c.jpg


What more need be said. The image says it all.

Verdict : Replacement coils sourced and bought.



Oil Cooler and hoses:

The oil cooler was pressure tested and flushed. It's ok, but one mounting lug which has literally been bolted in doesn't sit well with me.

As it is it's wrong, being a 999 item so I've replaced with a proper 1098/848 unit.

The oil lines.. well... this is what I'm up against.. bsb mechanic I tell thee... Bullshit bernard I think it stands for.

51369354111_f332258b8f_c.jpg


Like on the R, the RS models the oil hoses push into the crankcases and retained by a plate as you all know.

So... the original lines were probably trollied and with that he removes the union from the knackered lines. Rather than re-swage them onto new lines he bodges them into a fitting - which must have take some doing, so that he can fit stock non R lines to it.

hardly redeemable in itself but the lines themselves are trollied, and the union was been royally rounded off and is pretty wretched.

51369577663_4abb27b119_c.jpg




Verdict: Bin and replace.

In itself not the end of the world were it not for the R lines running at 110 quid a line. That's right children 220 bones for a pair of oil lines.

I've found a set of diavel lines which are longer but terminate in the same fittings.

Two wheeled spares wanted 80 notes. Breaker in the USA worked out less with import duty and delivery, go figure.

The hope is that I can get the lines shortened and re-swaged and mitigate having to fork out 220 bones. If it doesn't work... well ... looks like I'll get my wallet out and bend over.


After looking through bits and twiddling and fiddling I'm starting to wonder if even the engine itself can be trusted at this point in the game.

Apparently the owner prior to our parish member was an ex BSB mechanic. Of course he was. Aren't they all sir.

However, the frame is now done so a trip to Clutton is due to pick it up. The rad mount tang is a little bent, but overall its a minor concern compared to whether I split the engine or not for piece of mind.

Onwards McDuff..
 

final_edition

Elite Member
Subscriber
Latest discoveries:

Plug Coils:

51369354131_4c4e52699d_c.jpg


What more need be said. The image says it all.

Verdict : Replacement coils sourced and bought.



Oil Cooler and hoses:

The oil cooler was pressure tested and flushed. It's ok, but one mounting lug which has literally been bolted in doesn't sit well with me.

As it is it's wrong, being a 999 item so I've replaced with a proper 1098/848 unit.

The oil lines.. well... this is what I'm up against.. bsb mechanic I tell thee... Bullshit bernard I think it stands for.

51369354111_f332258b8f_c.jpg


Like on the R, the RS models the oil hoses push into the crankcases and retained by a plate as you all know.

So... the original lines were probably trollied and with that he removes the union from the knackered lines. Rather than re-swage them onto new lines he bodges them into a fitting - which must have take some doing, so that he can fit stock non R lines to it.

hardly redeemable in itself but the lines themselves are trollied, and the union was been royally rounded off and is pretty wretched.

51369577663_4abb27b119_c.jpg




Verdict: Bin and replace.

In itself not the end of the world were it not for the R lines running at 110 quid a line. That's right children 220 bones for a pair of oil lines.

I've found a set of diavel lines which are longer but terminate in the same fittings.

Two wheeled spares wanted 80 notes. Breaker in the USA worked out less with import duty and delivery, go figure.

The hope is that I can get the lines shortened and re-swaged and mitigate having to fork out 220 bones. If it doesn't work... well ... looks like I'll get my wallet out and bend over.


After looking through bits and twiddling and fiddling I'm starting to wonder if even the engine itself can be trusted at this point in the game.

Apparently the owner prior to our parish member was an ex BSB mechanic. Of course he was. Aren't they all sir.

However, the frame is now done so a trip to Clutton is due to pick it up. The rad mount tang is a little bent, but overall its a minor concern compared to whether I split the engine or not for piece of mind.

Onwards McDuff..
From my recent experiences with buying an engine being built by a renown builder, is that it would've been prudent to have it stripped, inspected, rectified where needed then rebuilt.
 

final_edition

Elite Member
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The oil cooler fittings in my 1098rs oil cooler were chopped off, as they are also push in fittings.

The previous owner then screwed male fittings directly into the cut off tubes..

Pro Alloy pressure tested to 3 bar and it leaked..

They then made and fitted the -4 fittings on for me.
 

dibble

Honorary Northerner
Bit late to the party, the Laverty bike was last seen in the livery below, thats how it was released from JHP to the owner before Dallas.

Dallas bought it to race, was warned it was an animal and tole to ease himself into it, Dallas being Dallas, and I love him, went 'full send' first time out on it, barrel rolling it through the scenery and turning it into a very very expensive jigsaw puzzle, regards the frame, I suspect it may not be the one that Dallas crashed, if it is, check it very very carefully ...

Screenshot 2021-08-26 at 12.16.18.png

Here it is with my fat backside on it at Brands Hatch ...
 
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