The definitive Lithium Battery Thread

AirCon said:
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I don't like potatoes too much starch and carbohydrates 👀
 

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West Cork Paul said:
@Char already posted it last night 👍

What have you done on your bike today?

That is a short rear fender isn’t it? That’s going to through up a lot of shite and mines 2x as big as the one on the Tesi. What’s the white sticky back plastic? I thought helicopter tape was just tape, csn you get it in sheets? Ffs it’s only seeing 3hrs a year on the tarmac and 1hour is on...
www.ducati.community www.ducati.community
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Ah, the bloke dancing in his dining room (y)
 
West Cork Paul said:
Hopefully this link will work 👍

Here’s an example of what happens with cheap lithium batteries and the wrong sort of charger 😱

https://www.facebook.com/100000727810714/posts/5235406143160261

Hmmmm 🤔, try this one

Log in to Facebook

Log in to Facebook to start sharing and connecting with your friends, family and people you know.
www.facebook.com www.facebook.com
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FFS..... you have to join the group with your CV, dob, grandparents place of birth, full family tree to the reformation ......
 
I fitted a Lithium battery to my Monster S4r. I can say, without fear of contradiction, that they are shit! I got knocked off the bike and the bike was totalled.

It was all down to the pesky battery!

I think. . . . . . . . . .

But on a more serious note, the advantage is weight saving. You can save weight for free by just eating less. I like to help . . . . . . . . .
 
PerryL said:
I fitted a Lithium battery to my Monster S4r. I can say, without fear of contradiction, that they are shit! I got knocked off the bike and the bike was totalled.

It was all down to the pesky battery!

I think. . . . . . . . . .

But on a more serious note, the advantage is weight saving. You can save weight for free by just eating less. I like to help . . . . . . . . .
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Changed the Centre of Gravity, so probably contributed to the accident.

Serious note.
Lithium Batteries are a bit more temperamental than Lead Acid.....
Analogy
Think 21 year old Cornish art student on weed for the lead acid and
21 year old Marketing student on Acid/Coke/Meth, with Southern Irish / Caribbean heritage for LiPo.
 
First off I should mention I didn't read the entire 7 pages before posting this so I may have missed something along the way.

But it's the internet, so why let that stop me?

I've had some experience with lithium batteries, specifically EarthX brand batteries. These come with built in protection against overcharging and over discharging.

So having bought an 851 that had basically sat for ten years I was going through the process of getting it back on the road, changing belts, etc. Along the way I decided one of those newfangled Lithium batteries would be cool, so I bought one and installed it.

All was well with the world right up until it wasn't. Out for a ride one day, the engine cut out. Just stopped running for a second, and then started up again. Well, it is an older Ducati that hasn't seen much use for a decade. These things will happen. And right around the point I had convinced myself of that, the bike died for good. (I had maybe 150 miles on it at this point).

Pulled to the side of the road. Removed the seat to check the fuses, and noticed a whisp of smoke from something. Then the whisp became a stream. Then billowing. That it was a battery issue became obvious when I saw arcing through the smoke. I'm no electrical engineer but I'm guessing being able to see the internals of the battery probably isn't good.

Things happend kinda fast at this point so I'll just mention a few things I learned in no certain order.

The first was, you can not remove the fairing from an 851 with the factory supplied tool kit. There are two bolts that are smaller than the smallest tool in said tool kit. So no removing the fairing, cutting the wires, and tossing the battery into the field so that burns instead of the bike.

Second thing, the smoke from a battery going all China syndrome REEKS. Like oh my god it's horrible. That CAN'T be good for you.

So at this point I'm basically standing on the side of the road, watching the show, wondering if the arcing will turn to flames. (It didn't).

A guy from the house I was stopped in front of came out to offer assitance, saying "Yeah... I could tell that wasn't steam..."

The guy I was riding with had doubled back too, so now three of us were standing there watching and twiddling our thumbs. No one took bets on if it would flame up but we were all thinking it I'm sure.

Eventually most of the smoke had leaked out so I took a little video. Some of the language is not safe for work.

Jump ahead to the bike being put on a trailer and towed home. Here are a few pics of the aftermath.
earthx04.jpg


earthx01.jpg


earthx02.jpg


After removing the battery the scorched plastic still reeked. I had to pull it off and clean it before I could put the bike back in the garage.

The aftermath.
EarthX wanted the battery sent back to them. They looked at it and said it had been overcharged to a point it overpowered the battery protection which meant 60+ volts. They have increased the over-voltage protection since that battery was built though.

I tested the regulator after sending them the battery. Yep, it was shot. I shut the bike off when it hit 16 volts, didn't test at higher rpm.

I replaced the regulator with a MOSFET unit, added a voltage meter, and put another EarthX in the bike. That was... 5 years ago? No issues since.

I also had to replace the ECU - I had to remove it for some reason and noticed it was rattling. I popped the cover and found some component had come unsoldered. I did a little research and found out that component had something to do with over voltage protection. I also had to replace a couple other electrical components - a bulb, a relay, and some other forgotten item(s).

I learned that there are different types of lithium batteries. EarthX and others use lithium IRON, which is less likely to start on fire than lithium ION batteries. Confusion there is understandable - I bought one battery for another bike and it listed it as lithium iron on the box, but lithium ion in the info inside the box.

As I understand it, what happened was when lithium batteries get too much voltage fed into them, they basically start to plate their own internals. Eventually this leads to an internal short, and once that happens, there's nothing you can do. It's going to melt down.

Long story short, Lithium batteries are cool but don't put one in your old bike. Unless you're stupid, like me. I'll probably keep running them in the old stuff after upgrading the regulator and adding a volt meter cuz I detest heavy batteries.
 
Last edited:
DesmoDog said:
First off I should mention I didn't read the entire 7 pages before posting this so I may have missed something along the way.

But it's the internet, so why let that stop me?

I've had some experience with lithium batteries, specifically EarthX brand batteries. These come with built in protection against overcharging and over discharging.

So having bought an 851 that had basically sat for ten years I was going through the process of getting it back on the road, changing belts, etc. Along the way I decided one of those newfangled Lithium batteries would be cool, so I bought one and installed it.

All was well with the world right up until it wasn't. Out for a ride one day, the engine cut out. Just stopped running for a second, and then started up again. Well, it is an older Ducati that hasn't seen much use for a decade. These things will happen. And right around the point I had convinced myself of that, the bike died for good. (I had maybe 150 miles on it at this point).

Pulled to the side of the road. Removed the seat to check the fuses, and noticed a whisp of smoke from something. Then the whisp became a stream. Then billowing. That it was a battery issue became obvious when I saw arcing through the smoke. I'm no electrical engineer but I'm guessing being able to see the internals of the battery probably isn't good.

Things happend kinda fast at this point so I'll just mention a few things I learned in no certain order.

The first was, you can not remove the fairing from an 851 with the factory supplied tool kit. There are two bolts that are smaller than the smallest tool in said tool kit. So no removing the fairing, cutting the wires, and tossing the battery into the field so that burns instead of the bike.

Second thing, the smoke from a battery going all China syndrome REEKS. Like oh my god it's horrible. That CAN'T be good for you.

So at this point I'm basically standing on the side of the road, watching the show, wondering if the arcing will turn to flames. (It didn't).

A guy from the house I was stopped in front of came out to offer assitance, saying "Yeah... I could tell that wasn't steam..."

The guy I was riding with had doubled back too, so now three of us were standing there watching and twiddling our thumbs. No one took bets on if it would flame up but we were all thinking it I'm sure.

Eventually most of the smoke had leaked out so I took a little video. Some of the language is not safe for work.

Jump ahead to the bike being put on a trailer and towed home. Here are a few pics of the aftermath.
earthx04.jpg


earthx01.jpg


earthx02.jpg


After removing the battery the scorched plastic still reeked. I had to pull it off and clean it before I could put the bike back in the garage.

The aftermath.
EarthX wanted the battery sent back to them. They looked at it and said it had been overcharged to a point it overpowered the battery protection which meant 60+ volts. They have increased the over-voltage protection since that battery was built though.

I tested the regulator after sending them the battery. Yep, it was shot. I shut the bike off when it hit 16 volts, didn't test at higher rpm.

I replaced the regulator with a MOSFET unit, added a voltage meter, and put another EarthX in the bike. That was... 5 years ago? No issues since.

I also had to replace the ECU - I had to remove it for some reason and noticed it was rattling. I popped the cover and found some component had come unsoldered. I did a little research and found out that component had something to do with over voltage protection. I also had to replace a couple other electrical components - a bulb, a relay, and some other forgotten item(s).

I learned that there are different types of lithium batteries. EarthX and others use lithium IRON, which is less likely to start on fire than lithium ION batteries. Confusion there is understandable - I bought one battery for another bike and it listed it as lithium iron on the box, but lithium ion in the info inside the box.

As I understand it, what happened was when lithium batteries get too much voltage fed into them, they basically start to plate their own internals. Eventually this leads to an internal short, and once that happens, there's nothing you can do. It's going to melt down.

Long story short, Lithium batteries are cool but don't put one in your old bike. Unless you're stupid, like me. I'll probably keep running them in the old stuff after upgrading the regulator and adding a volt meter cuz I detest heavy batteries.
Click to expand...
....the reason why.... oh its the internet, I can't be bothered.
 
DesmoDog said:
First off I should mention I didn't read the entire 7 pages before posting this so I may have missed something along the way.

But it's the internet, so why let that stop me?

I've had some experience with lithium batteries, specifically EarthX brand batteries. These come with built in protection against overcharging and over discharging.

So having bought an 851 that had basically sat for ten years I was going through the process of getting it back on the road, changing belts, etc. Along the way I decided one of those newfangled Lithium batteries would be cool, so I bought one and installed it.

All was well with the world right up until it wasn't. Out for a ride one day, the engine cut out. Just stopped running for a second, and then started up again. Well, it is an older Ducati that hasn't seen much use for a decade. These things will happen. And right around the point I had convinced myself of that, the bike died for good. (I had maybe 150 miles on it at this point).

Pulled to the side of the road. Removed the seat to check the fuses, and noticed a whisp of smoke from something. Then the whisp became a stream. Then billowing. That it was a battery issue became obvious when I saw arcing through the smoke. I'm no electrical engineer but I'm guessing being able to see the internals of the battery probably isn't good.

Things happend kinda fast at this point so I'll just mention a few things I learned in no certain order.

The first was, you can not remove the fairing from an 851 with the factory supplied tool kit. There are two bolts that are smaller than the smallest tool in said tool kit. So no removing the fairing, cutting the wires, and tossing the battery into the field so that burns instead of the bike.

Second thing, the smoke from a battery going all China syndrome REEKS. Like oh my god it's horrible. That CAN'T be good for you.

So at this point I'm basically standing on the side of the road, watching the show, wondering if the arcing will turn to flames. (It didn't).

A guy from the house I was stopped in front of came out to offer assitance, saying "Yeah... I could tell that wasn't steam..."

The guy I was riding with had doubled back too, so now three of us were standing there watching and twiddling our thumbs. No one took bets on if it would flame up but we were all thinking it I'm sure.

Eventually most of the smoke had leaked out so I took a little video. Some of the language is not safe for work.

Jump ahead to the bike being put on a trailer and towed home. Here are a few pics of the aftermath.
earthx04.jpg


earthx01.jpg


earthx02.jpg


After removing the battery the scorched plastic still reeked. I had to pull it off and clean it before I could put the bike back in the garage.

The aftermath.
EarthX wanted the battery sent back to them. They looked at it and said it had been overcharged to a point it overpowered the battery protection which meant 60+ volts. They have increased the over-voltage protection since that battery was built though.

I tested the regulator after sending them the battery. Yep, it was shot. I shut the bike off when it hit 16 volts, didn't test at higher rpm.

I replaced the regulator with a MOSFET unit, added a voltage meter, and put another EarthX in the bike. That was... 5 years ago? No issues since.

I also had to replace the ECU - I had to remove it for some reason and noticed it was rattling. I popped the cover and found some component had come unsoldered. I did a little research and found out that component had something to do with over voltage protection. I also had to replace a couple other electrical components - a bulb, a relay, and some other forgotten item(s).

I learned that there are different types of lithium batteries. EarthX and others use lithium IRON, which is less likely to start on fire than lithium ION batteries. Confusion there is understandable - I bought one battery for another bike and it listed it as lithium iron on the box, but lithium ion in the info inside the box.

As I understand it, what happened was when lithium batteries get too much voltage fed into them, they basically start to plate their own internals. Eventually this leads to an internal short, and once that happens, there's nothing you can do. It's going to melt down.

Long story short, Lithium batteries are cool but don't put one in your old bike. Unless you're stupid, like me. I'll probably keep running them in the old stuff after upgrading the regulator and adding a volt meter cuz I detest heavy batteries.
Click to expand...
See, see, told you so 🤣🤣🤣

Not you Desmodog but Karen (or Phil) on Facebook. There are so many posts on FB along the lines of, ‘well, I’ve fitted a lithium battery yo my Ducati to save 1kg in weight and make it faaaasssssttteerrrrrrr and it’s so much better and all good’ until it isn’t. Lithium batteries are VERY VERY suscepitble to the a) the voltage going into them, needs to be 14.2v, and b) the fluctuation. A reg/reg, if one looked at its output on an oscilloscope rather than a multimeter, would see it fluctuates. Lithium batteries don’t like that.

Thank you for your open and frank post 👍
 
West Cork Paul said:
See, see, told you so 🤣🤣🤣

Not you Desmodog but Karen (or Phil) on Facebook. There are so many posts on FB along the lines of, ‘well, I’ve fitted a lithium battery yo my Ducati to save 1kg in weight and make it faaaasssssttteerrrrrrr and it’s so much better and all good’ until it isn’t. Lithium batteries are VERY VERY suscepitble to the a) the voltage going into them, needs to be 14.2v, and b) the fluctuation. A reg/reg, if one looked at its output on an oscilloscope rather than a multimeter, would see it fluctuates. Lithium batteries don’t like that.

Thank you for your open and frank post👍
Click to expand...
How do you know so much about lithium batteries 🤔😁
 
West Cork Paul said:
See, see, told you so 🤣🤣🤣

Not you Desmodog but Karen (or Phil) on Facebook. There are so many posts on FB along the lines of, ‘well, I’ve fitted a lithium battery yo my Ducati to save 1kg in weight and make it faaaasssssttteerrrrrrr and it’s so much better and all good’ until it isn’t. Lithium batteries are VERY VERY suscepitble to the a) the voltage going into them, needs to be 14.2v, and b) the fluctuation. A reg/reg, if one looked at its output on an oscilloscope rather than a multimeter, would see it fluctuates. Lithium batteries don’t like that.

Thank you for your open and frank post👍
Click to expand...
We need to stay focused on the actual heat management of the generator set, as well as the actual batteries.
 
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