no BSB for DUK

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By David Miller
Hot on the heels of the news that Michael Rutter will ride for Rob Mac Racing under NorthWest 200 colours, Ducati UK have said they will not be competing in British Superbikes next season, making it an all-Japanese series.

The firm expects to field bikes and riders in the Superstock class on the brand new 1198S but because the firm couldn't find a team that would be strong enough to win races in BSB, they have called it a day.

"The 1098R has proven to be a winning machine and this makes it all the more frustrating not to be in BSB next year, but we owe it to Ducati and to race fans to put together as strong a team as possible," said Ducati UK bos Tim Maccabee.

"Unfortunately due to a number of factors we have been unable find a team solution that will allow us to compete at the highest level. We do however expect to be back in 2010."
2009 BRITISH SUPERBIKE CALENDAR FINALISED

Courtesy of http://www.bikesportnews.com/articl..._UK_PULL_OUT_OF_BRITISH_SUPERBIKES_FOR_2009_1

2009 British Superbike calendar
April 10/11/12/13 Brands Hatch Indy
May 2/3/4 Oulton Park
May 23/24/25 Donington Park
May 29/30/31 Thruxton
June 19/20/21 Snetterton
July 3/4/5 Knockhill
July 17/18/19 Mallory Park
August 7/8/9 Brands Hatch GP
August 29/30/31 Cadwell Park
September 11/12/13 Croft
September 25/26/27 Silverstone
October 9/10/11 Oulton Park
 
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no complaints from me, BSB is a waste of cash and the $ might now get spent working with dealers organising events all Ducasti can enjoy, be nice to have a Scottish/northern event with DUK supporting it wouldn't it?
 
Looks like they've replaced WSB at Brands with an August BSB round but with no DUK will we have another DUN/SDC expedition :dunno:
 
You'll still have the twin sounds with the Harley single make and KTM single make races.
[cynical]
Or have they suddenly woken up and smelt the coffee after soooo long.
[/cynical]
 
Gizmo said:
no complaints from me, BSB is a waste of cash and the $ might now get spent working with dealers organising events all Ducasti can enjoy, be nice to have a Scottish/northern event with DUK supporting it wouldn't it?
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Funny you should say that.;) :D
 
Personally, BSB and others are taking the @@@@. Deffo not VFM.
Sorry, bad day + bad head + very wet ride home = cynical Al
 
Gizmo said:
no complaints from me, BSB is a waste of cash and the $ might now get spent working with dealers organising events all Ducasti can enjoy, be nice to have a Scottish/northern event with DUK supporting it wouldn't it?
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sorry mike but i think that BSB is one of the premier domestic championships in the world...and any loss of factory support will have a detrimental effect on up and comming uk talent ..and "we" desperatly need home grown talent :D
 
Gizmo said:
no complaints from me, BSB is a waste of cash and the $ might now get spent working with dealers organising events all Ducatisti can enjoy, be nice to have a Scottish/northern event with DUK supporting it wouldn't it?
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Sorry Michael - can't agree there mate!

BSB is a THE BEST training ground for new and new British riders outside of GPs. Look at (in no particular order) Haslam, Byrne, Toseland, Bayliss, Sykes, Hill, Crutchlow, Rea, Kiyonari, Hodgson, Lavilla and so on! I mean how much more pedigree would you need to suggest our national series is one of the hottest contested on the planet? Look at how competitive our boys were at Portimao as a very recent example. The world and the world's manufacturers (eg Honda) watch BSB very, VERY closely indeed!

The WSB title has been won by no fewer than 3 riders covering 8 years, that started their professional careers in BSB Since 2001 (Bayliss x 3, Hodgson x 1, Toseland x 2) There is no other national series on the planet offering that spread of talent! (Bayliss is maybe an exception but here is where he was really noticed by Tardozzi to replace the injured Fogarty)

The very fact that Guintoli has come from GPs to BSB says something!

On the showroom floor, I can tell you that Byrnes success on the 1098R resulted in a serious number of sales. As a marketing ploy - Ducati's success with BSB has been a major influence on sales and a significant success over the last 6 or 7 years. To say i'm disappointed, professionally, personally and as a fan is an understatement to say the least.:(

I hope there are more events by all dealers but it's not that easy. Running a dealership and staffing a show or event (they're always on at the weekend of course when the store is busiest:rolleyes: ) is so difficult.

We did a large portion of our diary today - 6 or 7 trackdays, Scottish Motorcycle Show, BSB at Knockhill (we're still going I think!), foreign trackdays, SDC meetings, Sunday opening, staff holidays, multiple rideouts and a factory visit are what's going on so far - I might even have enough time to sell a bike or two!!!!;) All in a 6 - 7 month season! It's almost a full time job in itself supporting the lifestyle aspect of the brand.

This result by Ducati is a major blow to the series, the infrastructure, the supporting dealers (like me) the fans and the racing itself - a very sad day indeed.:(

Mart:(
 
We did a large portion of our diary today 6 or 7 trackdays, Scottish Motorcycle Show, BSB at Knockhill (we're still going I think!), foreign trackdays, SDC meetings, Sunday opening, staff holidays, multiple rideouts and a factory visit are what's going on so far - I might even have enough time to sell a bike or two!!!!;) All in a 6 - 7 month season! It's almost a full time job in itself supporting the lifestyle aspect of the brand.

Mart:([/QUOTE]



100% agree with what you said about BSB. There has been some remarkable talent come through the ranks in this series. It certainly got "JOE PUBLIC" talking about Ducatis & bikes in general. It glued them to their seats to watch & I bet it got a few of them from their seats onto a Ducati.

Highlight of your post Martin was that you have got your DG 2009 diary sorted.::thumbs: I am bound to get to one of the 6-7 trackdays this year.So I am waiting with baited breath & anticipation for the dates to be released on the DG site so that I can book up. Missed evey ............en thing that was organised by DG & SDC last year.:hissy: :hissy: :( :( Merry Crimbo when it come to you all at DG.:santagrin: :santagrin:
 
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BSB might be a home grown series to develop talent and result in some sales but you have to consider the cost, how much does it take to run 2 factory spec bikes and how much return do you see? I'll tell you now it doesn't add up. BSB does not need factory supported bikes, it needs teams using 1098's in privateer versions like Birdy used to with Honda etc etc, its the same for the riders, if its a home series wages shoud reflect that, no need for superstar demands. As riders progress they move on but that does not need or warrant factory support, they'ed do that on privateer bikes. There simply isn't the outside sponsorship $ around to pull in the money needed to lease bikes or run teams, the likes of JHP can only do it if they find the cash and they don't have the same approach to getting sponsors as the likes of Colin Wright or Birdy and can't expect DUK to stump up the cash, its simple economics reflected in almost every other sport that relies on sponsorship at the moment, the factories are walking away.

We're about to head into one of the toughest times for motorsport and when companies like Honda pull the plug so quickly you have to understand how serious it is financially. Ducati have the fan base, they've succesfully built it up over the last few years and given the financial situation can afford to take a step back, they can't support every series and people like Michael Lock in the US recognize this. its time for common sense and a co-ordinated marketing/sponsorship strategy and in their position I'd have pulled the plug as well.

I know you already do a lot Martin but wouldn't it be nice to get help from Ducati to run things like demo ride weekends, getting potential owners out on bikes, more events that build the Ducati community so that when owners buy the bikes they understand the difference it brings, evening events with factory staff coming along etc etc.?? DUK help provide the manpower and infastructure to do this reducing your time/costs but TBH I think anyone in business knows we're going to be working even harder just to stand still next year. For events like BSB knockhill you could put the truck in a field anywhere and I'd bet almost everyone who comes along to BSB would probably still come :D, its the company and chance to meet others they makes it a success along with your hard work.

We've still got Ducati in Moto GP and WSB and I'd rather have them there with the budgets they need than get into a situation where they are supporting too much and can't afford to do what they need in the premier classes, I'm pretty sure that sells more bikes globally than BSB and its simply not worth the risk committing to a domestic series and potentially damaging that. There's a much bigger picture to consider for them, DUK have been realistic about how much they can spend and aren't going to pay over the odds and risk everything, thats a sound strategy provided its backed up with using budget to help and support their dealers.

It might be a negative to many but ( unlike me i know :D) you have to look for the positives and use the opportunity to try new things, you never know they might work equally as well if not better.....
 
It's a shame but I could see it coming, I'd heard that JHP and NW200 wouldn't be partnered again in 2009 and obviously no GSE running the factory bikes so who else would be capable of running a factory team at the top level???

BSB is the pinnacle of bike racing in this country and has been said it's a huge springboard onto the world stage and a huge marketing exercise in regards to the coverage the series gets globally so to say it doesn't directlt affect the brand I find very hard to believe.

Just means we'll all have to be wearing our Yamaha/Suzuki/Honda etc tops in 2009 !
 
Freak said:
Just means we'll all have to be wearing our Yamaha/Suzuki/Honda etc tops in 2009 !
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Wonderbread for me!

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Freak said:
so to say it doesn't directlt affect the brand I find very hard to believe.
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It does affect the brand Jon but if you ain't got the money or team to do it you cut your cloth accordingly, don't worry every other team has this to face and its going to be an interesting year if sponsors can't fulfill their agreed commitments. In Ducati's position its the right call until the market settles down or improves. There is still WSB and Moto GP and maybe we can get something organised for a Ducati event on the Thursday or Friday of the GP, Ducati island like at Laguna, ride ins and more, you can wear your Suzuki shirt if you want :)
 
Gizmo said:
BSB might be a home grown series to develop talent and result in some sales but you have to consider the cost, ....................

.....................It might be a negative to many but ( unlike me i know :D) you have to look for the positives and use the opportunity to try new things, you never know they might work equally as well if not better.....
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All valid points Michael and I am very well aware the cost really does get serious.

BUT

For years the national teams have looked for factory bikes because
a) they need / want them to be competitive and win
b) they have secured the the cash / sponsorship to race them.

The racer's demand for performance comes before the factory steps in, they went looking for factory backed machinery, not the other way around. The factories have seen the benefit of our series and got involved. We have enjoyed the result for years nationally and now money is tight globally, racing gets the chop!

BSB and WSB HAVE to be better / quicker than Superstock to maintain the series' position in the grand scheme of things. Just in the same way as MotoGp has to stay in front of WSB (and it's getting close). If you remove the factories you get a tuned superstock series and that doesn't sell to the fans.

I agree with you about Ducati UK too but you've got to remember DUK consist of only 18 or so staff. Not all of those (in fact very few) people are in a position to help continually at weekend events.

DUK aren't the main company sponsoring the teams - not even nearly. Their involvement is very much secondary. I can tell you the money they put in to Airwaves and NW200 is nowhere near what you would think. In fact Airwaves and NW200 would still have raced without their funding.
This is not a strategy by DUK. The teams have simply not got the money to race. In conjunction, the big Jap companies have made offers the teams could not refuse, like paying for all the racing like Yam have apparently done for Airwaves GSE. Ground Services Europe have been hit really hard by the crunch and want to stay racing. Yamaha have committed the budget to do that. They didn't move from Ducati without thinking hard about it.

Whoever wins on whatever machine - will be a hollow victory as the question will always be asked "What would have happenend if Ducati were racing?

As I said it's very sad indeed!

Mart:(
 
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Martin, I agree with you its only down to money , if Ducati or DUK had stumped up the cash or bikes then Airwaves would still be racing on 1098's however they didn't have it and the best move is to walk away rather than p1ss money into teams who don't have the experience or riders to get results. Racing is only about finding the budgets, if you can't raise it from sponsors you go to the factory, believe me I have way too much experience of negotiating this at every level from domestic to global ! if Airwaves can create a team that gets factory support then its a credit to how its run, at that point its a biddign war and they'll take the best package that suits their needs (and those of their sponsors). Not every deal links to hard cash or bikes and occasionally joint brand/marketing potential does influence things but at this point in time the benefit would need to be substantial to even consider it.

I'd guess that DUK have little direct costs in Airwaves, the costs will be at a factory level and the Airwaves proposal would be passed to factory from DUK with DUK saying they want to do it. part of the factory costs gets allocated to the assistance distrubutors can expect to receive, whether thats in direct marketing, racing, a number of cheaper bikes for press/pr work whatever it all comes from same budget, it'll link to sales and profitability as well. Thats how I've ran our global sponsorship/marketing for many years, you can only put in what you see a return for and if the distributor says its where they want support you tend to go with them......

What is sad to me is that if the 1098 was all conquering I'd have thought some of the smaller teams would buy the bikes and race them, this is what happened in the mid nineties 916 glory days when grids were full of privateer Ducati's with little to no real support from the factory. The reality now is that the 1098 is too expensive for those small teams to race and doesn't hold the competitive advantage the 916 did, the privateer market they were trying to get back to has moved on :( If anything the failing lies with Ducati not getting a bike at a price those small teams can race on limited budgets if they had we'd still have bikes racing.
 
Am I alone in thinking that BSB will snatch the opportunity of having no Ducatis on the grid to push through a definitive 1 litre limit, preventing 1200 twins from returning in 2010?

Lets face it, which 2009 Jap backed team will vote against a change that suits their manufacturer? KTM haven't got the clout to prevent it happening....

Good job there's Ducs in WSB or building 1198 roadbikes to help homolgation might've been a complete waste of time :rolleyes:
 
WRT Honda, I would guess that shutting a factory for 2 months and still spending £300M on jumped up never come down up their own rectum racing drivers would maybe smart a little for any of the workers laid off.
Anything corporate whilst your workers are being made redundant is somewhat tasteless to a lot of people who know the cost of everything but the value of nothing.
 
69jme69 said:
sorry mike but i think that BSB is one of the premier domestic championships in the world...and any loss of factory support will have a detrimental effect on up and comming uk talent ..and "we" desperatly need home grown talent :D
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I agree - what a shame the champions don't feel they can defend their crown in front of the Japs and our home grown talent will need to ride rice burners.
Shame DUK and Bologna are so short sighted to walk away from the best national series in the world.
 
Gizmo said:
Martin, I agree with you its only down to money , if Ducati or DUK had stumped up the cash or bikes then Airwaves would still be racing on 1098's however they didn't have it and the best move is to walk away rather than p1ss money into teams who don't have the experience or riders to get results. Racing is only about finding the budgets, if you can't raise it from sponsors you go to the factory, believe me I have way too much experience of negotiating this at every level from domestic to global ! if Airwaves can create a team that gets factory support then its a credit to how its run, at that point its a biddign war and they'll take the best package that suits their needs (and those of their sponsors). Not every deal links to hard cash or bikes and occasionally joint brand/marketing potential does influence things but at this point in time the benefit would need to be substantial to even consider it.

I'd guess that DUK have little direct costs in Airwaves, the costs will be at a factory level and the Airwaves proposal would be passed to factory from DUK with DUK saying they want to do it. part of the factory costs gets allocated to the assistance distrubutors can expect to receive, whether thats in direct marketing, racing, a number of cheaper bikes for press/pr work whatever it all comes from same budget, it'll link to sales and profitability as well. Thats how I've ran our global sponsorship/marketing for many years, you can only put in what you see a return for and if the distributor says its where they want support you tend to go with them......

What is sad to me is that if the 1098 was all conquering I'd have thought some of the smaller teams would buy the bikes and race them, this is what happened in the mid nineties 916 glory days when grids were full of privateer Ducati's with little to no real support from the factory. The reality now is that the 1098 is too expensive for those small teams to race and doesn't hold the competitive advantage the 916 did, the privateer market they were trying to get back to has moved on :( If anything the failing lies with Ducati not getting a bike at a price those small teams can race on limited budgets if they had we'd still have bikes racing.
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It's funny how Rob Mac can afford it though isn't it -?????
 
malcolm wade said:
It's funny how Rob Mac can afford it though isn't it -?????
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eh?? its simple Rob Mac manages to sell sponsorship, thats the art of team management, the likes of JHP are great technicians but lack the marketing ability to pull in a sponsor, the principles are hardly rocket science its how all racing works.

Its even easier when you already have a 2 man team and add a rider, even better when he brings his personal sponsor, NW200 don't have the cash to run a team by themselves they need more cash or to help JHP find more cash, that cash isn't around or the presentations to potential sponsors weren't good enough, yeah, they'll have asked DUK but as Martin says DUK don't put a lot in and don't have money to do this.

RMR already have the infastructure going to every race, truck, mechanics, hospitality so one more bike adds little provided the riders wage is covered ( which it will be by NW200) its purchase/lease of a bike tyres and a mechanic and thats about it. With an extra sponsor there it also benefits RMR's racing other sponsors as their branding gets pushed out in anything NW200 promote. Makes sense to me and I've seen it happen enough times in MTB racing to know how easy it is to put together.
 
Sorry I don't agree with the NW200 reference saying they don't have the cash, Kennedy has more than a few mill tucked away the guy runs the NW for a start if he wanted he could a top flight factory team or even buy BSB if he wanted too
 
Freak said:
Sorry I don't agree with the NW200 reference saying they don't have the cash, Kennedy has more than a few mill tucked away the guy runs the NW for a start if he wanted he could a top flight factory team or even buy BSB if he wanted too
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but why would he spend a fortune on a team? Its not about how much money you have tucked away its about return on investment, sponsorship is a means to an end usually in an attempt to generate more cash. NW200 will need more just to keep their own events going this year so they'll allocate a budget for marketing and promotion( which is all racing is) and expect others to join in with them, if no-one does they'll do the sensible thing and tie up with a team who have sponsors and share the costs. Provided its non conflicting sponsors they benefit as does the team. It would be stupid to blow all yout money on a team as a promotion vehicle and never see a return.
 
Gizmo said:
but why would he spend a fortune on a team? Its not about how much money you have tucked away its about return on investment, sponsorship is a means to an end usually in an attempt to generate more cash. NW200 will need more just to keep their own events going this year so they'll allocate a budget for marketing and promotion( which is all racing is) and expect others to join in with them, if no-one does they'll do the sensible thing and tie up with a team who have sponsors and share the costs. Provided its non conflicting sponsors they benefit as does the team. It would be stupid to blow all yout money on a team as a promotion vehicle and never see a return.
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Thought Ducati UK and Bologna might see it as a valid ROI opportunity - but then again, obviously not.
 
malcolm wade said:
Thought Ducati UK and Bologna might see it as a valid ROI opportunity - but then again, obviously not.
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I'm sure they would if financial circumstances were different but the way things are I wouldn't waste money that might be needed to keep the company afloat. Racing has limited success selling bikes, things like road tests and winning head to head tests has a lot more impact. We've spent 2 years building up a buyers survey on why people buy high performance mountain bikes and race results rarely (if ever) mentioned, recommendation and mag reviews are though. racing helps build brand awareness which is great if you can afford to do it but not if you can't.
 
If you can only produce 10,000 superbikes a year, and there's a waiting list for them, them promoting them through racing is a fairly pointless (and expensive!) exercise in terms of generating additional sales ........ better to use the money, as you say, ensuring you are still a viable company when the good times return.....
 
Bert3 said:
If you can only produce 10,000 superbikes a year, and there's a waiting list for them, them promoting them through racing is a fairly pointless (and expensive!) exercise in terms of generating additional sales ........ better to use the money, as you say, ensuring you are still a viable company when the good times return.....
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Some of the earlier replies alluded to the alternative way forward IMO, diversify into promoting other genres. Here's a wake up - NOT ALL DUCATIS ARE SUPERBIKES! so running the BSB promotes the 1198's and maybe gets the punter into the shop in the first place, but are Ducati withdrawing from all promotional stuff - monster racing et cetera?
 
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